– Welcome everybody to today’s Building My Legacy Podcast. I have with me today, Gretta Scholten. She is a life coach and she works with people in many walks of life, but in business as well, who are looking to really manage their time, optimize their time so they can have the results that they want. And I think, Gretta, this becomes such a huge issue for those of us who are looking for those next steps of where we wanna go, for legacy building, especially because many of us have operated in an organism and or organization, of which we’ve got lots of people working with us and we can pass things off, delegate, right? And suddenly, when you’re in a startup business or you’re going to develop a foundation, as many people do when they’re building a legacy, it’s like, “How do I do this? And how do I manage my time so I can optimize it for the results I want? So share with the audience how you got into this, what drew you to time management and then we’ll go from there.

– Yeah, so I feel like kinda time management organization was always in my DNA. My first career was actually as an occupational therapist, where my primary job was setting goals for my clients and helping them achieve them. And so that requires a lot of planning and a lot of forethought. So I feel like that was kind of just a natural talent of mine. And then I started in the life coaching and just merged those talents of helping other people learn to manage their time well and really step back and take a look at what they wanna create in the future.

– What do you see are the biggest challenges people face in time management?

– I think it’s really, what most people don’t do is plan ahead.

– Oh.

– They’re more reactive, they put out fires, they’re kind of in it. So most people just don’t take a step back and look at the big picture and see what they really wanna achieve and then break those steps down. I think we kind of, even if we do take a step back, we tend to then just be overwhelmed at the gap between where we are now and where we wanna be. And what we don’t do is take the time to break down those steps and even look at those steps into kind of bite-size, easy pieces. So I think it’s kind of twofold.

– So that’s a skill in itself to plan ahead. So how do you get people to get to that place? Planning ahead to me implies you have a vision of what that future is going to be.

– Yeah.

– So how do you take people down that journey if they’re not used to doing that?

– Yeah, I do think you bring up a good point in terms of knowing where you want to go. If you don’t know where you wanna go, this piece is gonna be really challenging and I think if you don’t know where you want to go, I think there is a lot of trial and error in that gap to kind of that out. But once you know where you want to go, I think it really is asking yourself, “What do I need to learn? “What do I need to do? “What am I believing right now about that end goal? “And where am I not in belief that I can achieve “that end goal?” Those do become the steps in terms of planning ahead.

– So is there a process you walk people through to get there? Because I’m trying to wrap my hands around that. I’m one of those people who loves to plan. So I have probably tried everybody’s time management system that there is out there and then in the end develop my own, right? But I think there’s a process. And so what kind of a process do you walk people through?

– Yeah, I mean, and I do think there are tactics, but the first process really is writing down that list of everything that you don’t know how to do and that you need to figure out. And then that next step really is breaking those things down further and then putting them into a digital calendar. And I don’t recommend to-do lists, I don’t recommend having lists scattered everywhere, I don’t recommend paper calendars. I really do recommend a digital calendar. And then putting in those steps into your calendar as they are completed. So you would write something like for a blog post, for example, blog post written into your calendar. It helps our brains really see the vision of it being done.

– Okay, so a part of also what I’m hearing you say, is when you do that, you are building in a reward process for the brain. So it’s like, “Okay, brain do this work.” And then you go, “Brain, good job, you did it, “you can check it off.” Is that part of the psychology behind what you’re doing?

– Yeah, A little bit. And then it’s also just really, when you look at your calendar, your brain can visualize a lot easier that task in completion rather than as a process. So it just really helps you get into action, instead of having this vague idea out there. And that’s the other step, is also why we wanna break down those bigger things. Because if we don’t break them down, our brain really indulges in confusion and overwhelm and that’s what really keeps us stuck. And so breaking those tasks down into those bite-size pieces that are results driven, it really helps us stay in action, instead of getting stuck in confusion.

– So tell me how many things can you logically put on your calendar in a day and feel like you could succeed at the end of the day?

– I think that’s very different person to person. I think everybody has a different tolerance for what’s too much and what’s not enough. I really think that piece is very much trial and error. But what I do recommend is at the end of the week, asking yourself, “Did I produce the things I wanted to produce this week?” I think that’s a really important question, that most of us don’t do, is evaluate our weeks and ask ourselves those questions.

– So do you put that evaluation process right in your calendar as well?

– Yes, yes.

– So you take the time to do it? Good for you.

– Yes.

– When I first started many, many years ago, I think it was Odion, in one of his books, talked about how important that was for a leader to reflect at every Friday on the successes, and the areas where they had challenges, and then where they had dropped the ball and what they were gonna do differently in the coming weeks, so they could actually enter the coming week with changed behavior, which is the challenge. ‘Cause we tend to run into the next week hoping to just pick up the balls while we’re still running.

– Yeah. And I think that’s such an important piece, because if you don’t do that, you could just keep repeating the same things and we’re not stepping back to evaluate if those things are effective, and useful and making us money or whatever that goal is. I think the evaluation piece of what worked, what didn’t, what I would change every single week will keep you into evolving, and growing and then eventually creating the things that you do want to create.

– So Gretta, I’m hearing you say that one of the biggest pitfalls is not taking time. And we feel so overwhelmed with time. So talk a little bit about managing time in this digital world. You talk about putting things into your computer or your smartphone so it’s immediately available to you. What are those? There’s other challenges that that brings with it. So if you would talk a little bit about that as well.

– Yeah, I think most of us feel a little out of control around our phones or we can get very sucked into our phones, whether that’s news, or social media or whatever it is. One thing that I do, is schedule my calendar that I think is a game changer, is scheduling in times for email, scheduling times for social media, scheduling times for news and only checking those things then, no other time. And then also in hand in hand with that, is turning off all of my notifications except for my calendar notifications. So the only thing that ding and pop up is the next thing on my calendar. I think those two things can really help minimize distractions and keep us managing our time well.

– So one of the challenges, I think people in corporate America face right now, is responsiveness, is an expectation be very responsive to emails, right? And so, the logic behind that is that if you delay in responding to someone’s question, that may be X amount of productivity dollars lost and it can be very costly if it’s multiplied over a number of people. But if you’re constantly responding, we’re also losing focus on what it is that you’re doing. These are balls we’re having in the air all the time. What do you suggest that people do to be able to be in control of that?

– Yeah, I think even if you are someone that feels like you do need to check your email more frequently, I would even just schedule that in more frequently. Even if it’s every half hour, every hour, whatever you determine that timeframe to be, that’s what I would recommend. That way you’re not at the effect of your email, you don’t feel like you’re sucked in and you’re constantly chasing. It’s very structured time, even if it is very frequently structured time.

– So for you, tell us some of the biggest successes you’ve had with time managing. Why does that really, really make a difference? I mean, there’re people who fly by the seat of their pants and they seem successful, right?

– Yeah

– You wonder how they do it, but they do. And so tell us about your successes and how you have really worked with people to give them that sense of confidence that time management brings.

– Yeah. I think the biggest thing is you learn that you can do so much more in so much less time. You realize how much time we actually have and how much we can get done. And I think for the vast majority of us, we have no idea how much we can actually produce when we’re focused, we have a good plan and we follow through with that plan. And we’re honest with ourselves that when we’re working on something, we’re not also checking email or also pulling ourselves away. We can do so much more. And I feel like that’s been my biggest takeaway is it’s I’ve gotten four times as much done in the same amount of time than I ever thought possible Yeah, the same with my clients too. It blows their minds when they realize, most people don’t even realize how unfocused we are when we’re working. We think we’re working and focused, but when we really, really do it this way and schedule in time, it’s just one of those things that we don’t even realize how distracted we are until we truly take away those distractions and be honest with ourselves about how much we were distracted before.

– So part of time management to me also implies there’s a discipline that you bring, that you’re willing to bring, right?

– Yes, yeah.

– And so there’s a mindset component to this.

– I would argue that it’s a 100% mindset thing, not even a component. I think time management is mind management. And I think what goes along with following our calendar, is you have to be willing to feel the urges or the desire to do something else. And to not fight against that and argue with that feeling, to just expect that you’re going to want to check your phone, you’re going to think that something else in the moment is more important. And to just recognize that those urges and those thoughts are going to come up for you, that’s totally normal, but to not react to them. That’s the key right there. Is to not react to them.

– Here are a couple of challenges that I’ve experienced. And one is, there are projects I look at and I go, “Oh, okay, I’ll push that to the bottom.” Right? And I’ve learned that doesn’t work so well. It keeps getting pushed to the bottom and then the next day. So I have to do a different strategy. So you wanna speak to that?

– Yes. So that’s totally normal to have that desire. I would say it’s a couple of things probably is breaking up that project or whatever that is, breaking that up into those small, little bite-sized pieces. What’s the next step you need to take on that project, right? Betting your schedule as a separate piece and do that with every single piece, that helps a lot. And then to also just expect, even when they are broken up. If it’s something new, our brains, don’t like to do anything new, because we think it’s dangerous, because our brains wanna keep us safe, and comfortable and exerting as little energy as possible. So doing new things is the opposite of safety, and comfort and familiar. And so I think just knowing that and expecting it to be that way, that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t do it. It just means you are growing, that is your growth right there. And that’s why it feels that way. I think those two pieces of knowledge are really helpful, when entering a new project and that feeling, that desire to push it away.

– It’s fascinating you say that, ’cause so when you don’t want to do it, perhaps the question you have to ask yourself is, “Have I broken it “down into enough steps that I can actually do it?”

– Yes, yes.

– That’s a great, great tip, I think, for people.

– Yeah. And if you worried it’s not broken down enough or another sign to me is if you’re feeling resistance to something on your calendar, that can be a sign to kind of ask yourself, “Okay, how could I break this down even further?” Sometimes it just seems silly. It should seem so basic and simple. For giant tasks for me or what I perceive as a giant task, sometimes I’ll even write it as simply as sit down at the computer, open up X program, whatever it is. I mean, it should seem almost silly. If you’re having a lot of resistance, I would break it down to the point of where it seems almost childish. And not in a way that you’re speaking down to yourself, but you just wanna make it as simple for your brain as possible to take that next step.

– Here’s the other thing I have found is I tend to be fairly driven. So stopping is a hard thing. And the problem that COVID and all of this has presented is I can start at four in the morning and keep going until 10 o’clock at night. Nothing that says, “Okay, I’ve got it. “Now, pack up and go home.” You’re operating out of your home environment, so there’s not that natural start and stop break that we have. But as I was thinking about that, part of also what it does is the list grows so I can get more done. But what I have had to learn to do is to build in breaks and to give yourself permission to have breaks, ’cause otherwise, the list becomes oppressive.

– Yeah. I think one of the first questions I would ask to yourself or to anybody else doing this work, is why do you not wanna stop? Usually, there’s some fear. Or- Something-

– Interesting

– Behind that. So that might be to me, that would be a good place to start, is kind of asking yourself why you don’t wanna stop. I do think building in natural breaks are a really helpful thing or setting a stop time for you in whatever or whoever’s doing this to when you wanna be done and what you wanna have produced at the end of that time. So it’s very clear to your brain what you will have produced at the end of that time and then to respect the end of that time, whether or not you got that thing done.

– Those are great, great tips and practical, right? I mean, I think also our brain likes both simplicity in that practicalness, because if we’re gonna do this, don’t make the process so difficult that I have to really think about process before I can get to doing. And I think sometimes people’s solutions are more complex than-

– Oh, absolutely.

– Right?

– Absolutely.

– So, Gretta, tell me something else. Do you have a course that you take people through? Or how do you work with people in terms of time management?

– Yeah, I don’t have a course, I do work with women one to one and it’s really beautiful in that, it’s really tailored to each client specifically. There are what I would call the foundational four that I take all of my clients through. It’s just the work that all of my clients need that I think everybody could benefit from. And that first piece is planning 24 hours in advance.

– So you have a timeframe on when you plan. Okay, great.

– Yep, plan 24 hours in advance into a digital calendar. And as we talked about, you wanna plan for those results. The way I like to ask myself is if I had someone else checking my work how would they know I was done with that task? What am I gonna have to show at the end of that time block? And then the second one is just schedule social media, email and Slack, if that’s a program that you use. The next one is to feel their feelings. So to feel when you’re feeling uncomfortable. Most of us try to busy ourselves away when we’re feeling uncomfortable or we have certain emotions that we don’t wanna feel. That’s such a huge component to following through with your plan, is really being willing to feel all of your emotions. I think that’s sometimes labeled as this very soft skill, but really, why we do anything is because of how we feel or how we think we’re going to feel. So really being willing to feel uncomfortable. And then that last step is a kind of allowing those urges or those desires to do something that’s off of our schedule and to notice those desires and to expect them too and not to think that they’re not gonna come up, because they will. So those are really the four skills that I take all of my clients through and then everything else is very much customized to each client depending on what they’d like to work on.

– Got it. So, Gretta, you work largely with women.

– Correct. And what are the challenges for time management that are unique to women and their lives?

– Yeah. I think there are a lot of challenges that are unique, especially during these times. Especially women who have children that may have been working outside of the house and now that are working at home. And if they’ve got kids that are also working or taking school remotely, having to balance both of those things, I think that’s probably one of the biggest challenges right now that women are seem to be facing maybe more than men, perhaps. Not all the time, that’s not a blanket rule, but that does seem to be the most prevalent right now. And to me, that really brings up a need to be planning in reality. And so you might wanna get a lot more done, but just being very realistic and very gentle and kind with yourself about what’s going on right now and what the realities of your day are. And not just that you can’t get things done, but also be honest with yourself about what else is happening in your day to day life

– Gretta, I think that’s one of the things that’s so difficult, because in a sense, we’ve lost our ability to be honest. For example, if I say to somebody, “How are you?” “Fine, great.”

– Yeah.

– Right?

– And I know what the person is going through and I know it’s not great and it’s not fine. And so there’s an honesty you have to bring to it if you’re going to be effective in planning, right? You’ve gotta be honest about feelings, you gotta be honest about, “Did I break things down?”

– Yes, yes. Yeah, I totally agree. And I think we’re afraid to admit things to ourselves, because if we admit what we’re kind of thinking in the dark corners of our minds, we think that’s gonna bring that into reality, which really the opposite is true. We’re always reacting from those things we don’t wanna look at, but actually when we look at them and we shine a light on them, then we can see them for what they are. And it’s just these optional beliefs that aren’t serving us. So really the opposite is true. If we’re kind of willing to look at the worst case scenario or what we’re imagining the worst case scenario to be, then we have agency over it. It’s when we’re hiding it and trying to avoid it, is when we end up kind of bringing that forth into our lives.

– Gretta, as you look at women, people in business, people who are wanting to build a legacy, wanting to start a new business, whatever it is. Last pieces of advice that you want to give to our audience? Our time is almost up and so I just wanna make sure we haven’t missed anything that’s really important for them. Because I think time management is one of those basic things that we tend to say, “Oh, of course, everybody knows it, “nobody teaches it, so we don’t learn it “and we don’t know how to do it. So last pieces of advice or thoughts that you have?

– Yeah, and I think it kind of goes back to that honesty piece. I think being really honest like, “Am I happy with where I’m at right now? “Really? “Really, am I okay with this?” I think a lot of us keep repeating the same lives over and over, because we’ve invested so much time or money in one path. But I think first of all, being really honest about, “Am I happy with where I am right now? “Am I going to be happy 20 years from now looking back “what will I wish I would have done in this moment? “Right now? “Is that changing a career? “Is that starting a business?” Whatever it is, I think that’s the really the first piece. And really going to that future place, what do I want to create? What do I want my legacy to be? Because really, I control that right now. I really think that’s the most important question you can ask yourself. And if the answer is no, I think it’s then trial and error, trying just to discover what that is. What do you want to create? How can you do that?

– Control it now. And I think it is so powerful, isn’t it? When you look at the end and then move backwards to each of the steps that will get you to that point.

– Yeah. Yeah.

– Gretta, this has been so helpful and so wonderful to talk with you. I appreciate this on time and time management, because, boy, I think we could all just benefit so much by stopping, reflecting and ask yourselves the most basic question, that is, “Am I managing my time well? “And how could I do it better?” So thank you. And for those of you who are listening, we will have information about Gretta in the show notes. So you will be able to reach her or connect with her or if you have difficulty, you want further information, just let us know, we’ll be glad to connect you. Gretta, thank you so much for being with us today. And those who are listening, thank you for joining us in Building My Legacy Podcast.